Dealing with School Changes & Autism

As some of you may or may not know, our youngest daughter was diagnosed with Asperger's Syndrome last fall, which is a form of Autism. In fact, the psychological community is trying to eradicate the use of the term Asperger's Syndrome, and just call it highly functioning Autism, because they feel that a lot of people don't take Asperger's Syndrome seriously.

Two years ago, at the start of 2nd grade, Gilly got a teacher who was very observant, and realized that a lot of her "behavior" problems and general 'quirks' fit the bill for AS. After meeting and agreeing, we started the paper work for the school to test her. She was formally diagnosed last fall, and has been receiving a LOT of fantastic help from the school ever since then.

Fast forward to this Spring. The state is yet again cutting school funding- never mind that the state is actually looking at it's first year of bringing in more money than the budget currently is. This is the first year in several years that our state is looking at making a profit, instead of losing more. The new governor really feels, though, that our school age kids should lose $500 each towards the budget, and that college kids should get more of it.

Because of that, our city is losing almost $4m in budget money. They are closing down a school, a lot of people lost (or will lose) their jobs. It's a mess. It happened 2 years ago, which is how Gillian got lucky and wound up at the school she's in currently.

So, with the closing of one of the elementry schools, they have decided to turn the middle school into a 4th-8th instead of 5th-8th school. They are splitting the 4th and 5th graders into an "Upper Elementry" school in the same building- they'll have their own principal, different school hours, and be segregated from the middle school kids in 6th-8th grade.

I was not sure how to take that news- how would it effect Gillian? Would she get the same help up there that she gets now?

Turns out, her teacher, her principal, her special education teacher, and her social worker are all going up to the Upper El next year.

I'm excited- I know that new routines can be disruptive and confusing for Gillian, and couple that with a new school, and all new people, and I wasn't sure how well it would go over with her. But, she'll have the same type of break room she has now, she'll have the same core group of people around her, and I did request if it were at all possible, that she be placed with the same teacher next year. That one might be iffy- they have kids from 3 schools all coming in up there, and other new teachers, and 2 grades to work with. They did say they would definitely keep it under consideration, though.

 
We did her IEP for next year today, which stays basically the same. She gets breaks through out the day, does social group work to help her learn how to cope with people, that sort of thing.

On top of all of this, Gillian joined Girl Scouts this year. I'm really happy she's fitting in. I have always been hesitant to let her be in groups because I was never sure how they would react to her. A few months ago, one of her classmates invited her to join, and after talking with Gillian's teacher, I said why not? Her leader has a son on the spectrum, and has been fantastic with Gillian. The girls have really helped her, as well- she's finally in a group that I feel she's doing good in.

Point System Details

A few people have mentioned wanting to try a system like I've talked about, and while I did share some details, I wasn't really all that detailed in my description. I thought I would share the particulars with those who are interested.

First and foremost, the point system works on pointing out things that kids do that are both positive, and negative. You can tailor it to help work on specific behaviors- whether encouraging specific behavior, or discouraging specific behavior. It was introduced to us through our youngest daughter's school. She has Asperger's Syndrome, and the school finds that this system works better with kids who need more social and behavioral guidance than the majority of the school.

First thing you really want to do, is start a list of behavior- both good and bad. With us, we had fighting kids, screaming kids, chore avoidance, etc. We listed what we wanted to stop- the negative behavior. Then we listed what we wanted to see- doing chores without repeated remindings, helping each other out, talking instead of screaming, etc.

Once we had our list of things we wanted to stop seeing, and the things we wanted to start seeing, we had a good idea of what the worst problems were in the house. Some things we listed, I hadn't even realized were happening as much as they were until we thought about it- it helps if both parents are involved in this process, as some things may bother one parent more than the other.

After I had a list of behavior, I had to set the rules. Would a single infraction cost them a point? Or did they get a warning first? If so, how many warnings? We decided that 1 warning was sufficient. If you see the kids doing something from the negative list, you give them a warning- "Please don't do that," "Please stop", etc.

One of the main reasons we realized we needed a change, was because we found that in response to the kids, we were often resorting to screaming ourselves just to be heard over the kids, or to get them to listen. And really, who wants to spend their evenings screaming?

So, to that point, we decided that we would not scream if we saw negative behavior. If the kids opted not to listen to the warning, then we would tell them that they lost a point. If the behavior continues (and we've only had 1 instance where it has), we take the child aside and ask them to either calm down, or take a bedroom time out, on their own.

I also think it's important not to label the behavior as "bad", because all too often, the kids then think that because what they are doing is "bad", they must be bad as well.  So, for that, I label the behavior negative and positive, since those two words don't carry the recognition that "bad" or "good" carry.

Once we decided on the warnings, I had to decide on the points. Gillian's school does a max of 25 each day. I thought it might be better to start smaller, so we have a max of 10. We start the children right in the middle, at 5 points each. From there, they earn or lose points based on their behavior and actions of the day.

I did have a few rules when it comes to points:

1. You can not lose points from prior days- if you earned 10 points yesterday, they are yours to keep, regardless of what happened today.
2. Points are awarded or lost 1 at a time, unless it's an extreme instance, but never more than 2 are removed at a time. This is for us as much as for them- it prevents us from totally losing our own cool, and removing all of their points over something in the heat of the moment.
3. You can not go into negative points. IE: if you have 1 point and lose it, you can't lose anymore that day unless you earn them first. That isn't to say we might not be disappointed if negative behavior continues, though.
4. Points can only be "spent" once a week, on the weekends.
5. Each child is in charge of their chart. While we keep track of the points each day, they are in charge of writing their points down at the end of the evening.
6. Points that are not written down the day before are gone. We did help them out the first week, but we are trying to teach them to be responsible for their own points. Last night was the first night I did not record the points for the kids who forgot, and as a result, Chris and Raegan did not receive any points.

These rules are in place to help the kids realize that their actions have rewards and consequences, but also help them learn that they can't be punished yesterday for something that happened today (IE: removing yesterdays points because of something they did today).

Once we had some footing on what the points rules would be, we had to come up with a value- what are they worth? What is the "point" of collecting them? Without a purpose, then what are the kids trying to do better for?

I started thinking small. Gillian asks every now and then if she can get a shake from McDonalds, and I thought that might be a great place to start. Below is my list of rewards- they may change over time, but I thought overall, they fit good with our kids.

25 points- A small shake from McDonalds40 points- $5.0075 points- A movie ticket75 points- $10.00100 points- dinner out with a parent of your choice, at the location of your choice.

While there are some items on the list, I felt that the cash rewards would help with anything else the kids may want to get. I also encourage them to save their points up longer for bigger items. Raegan is saving up to get 2 movie tickets, so she can take a friend to the movies. Chris is saving up for cash for a new video game. Gillian isn't sure yet what she wants.

One important thing to keep in mind, is that point rewarding or taking away should happen while the kids are doing whatever it is that is giving or taking points away. If you want to reinforce the positive, and not encourage the negative, you have to address it while it is happening. If you wait until later, they might not fully realize the significance of the removal or rewarding.

Once Nick and I talked back and forth, changed some things, and fully agreed on the new system, we called a family meeting. We don't often have full, sit down, family meetings, so it was a bit unusual to them.

We discussed each point, and listened to the kids when they made suggestions, or asked questions.

I stressed that some specific things would not effect points. Mostly, grades. We also stressed that while some chore aspects are listed on the positive/negative list, they were not being rewarded for doing the chores specifically.

We agreed that chores needed to be done by a set time- 6pm on school days, noon on days off. That was more to address the overall slacking all 3 kids had gotten into the habit of, more so than doing the chores themselves. I have been awarding points since then if they do get the chores done before 6pm, which wasn't on the list, but I think will remain.

We also stressed that if we saw behavior, positive or negative, that was not on the list, we were still able to reward or remove based on that. The list was made to give them each a general idea of what changes we wanted to see, but that it's also there to help make a larger positive change in the whole family.

Here's a list of the specifics in our family that we wanted to change.

Positive:

• Being respectful towards your siblings
• picking up after yourself
• helping without being asked
• helping your siblings when they want help
• listening to your parents or siblnings
• behaving in an appropriate manner
• going to bed good on school nights.

Negative:

• Stomping through the house when angry
• Running through the house (Chris and Gilly generally run full speed ahead when moving from room to room)
• Screaming instead of using your words
• Threatening physical violence
• Being violent- hitting, kicking, chasing in anger, etc
• Bossing people around
• Interuptting or not listening when a parent or sibling talks
• Not finishing your chores before 6pm on school nights, and noon on non-school days
• Being disrespectful to a parent or sibling
• Worrying about sibling chore status, game time, etc. Worry about your own actions.
• Not going to bed on school nights.

With several of those, the behavior has improved dramatically. Here are some of the specific problems we have with each child.

Raegan

• Threatening physical violence. When angry, her first response is "Can I hit/kick/kill/stab him/her?" She obviously knows the answer is no, but it was something we hated hearing, and hated having her say. SInce we started, I think I've only heard it once.
• Stomping when angry- well, she IS almost 15. It has lessened.
• Not finishing your chores- She was REALLY bad about this, and had many nights where she only started her chores at 10. She has improved greatly, and is usually working on them within minutes of arriving home now.

Chris - Chris is not yet diagnosed with Aspergers, but we are almost certain he IS an aspie, which creates some challenges in and of itself.

• Running through the house- this has gotten better, but we do still have to remind him.
• Screaming when angry- he usually goes from trying to talk to all out melting down and screaming when he's upset. He has gotten better, though it does occasionally happen still.
• Bossing people around- he is very bad about telling everyone else what to do. This has improved greatly, as well.
• Interupting or not listening- this is a big one with him and Gillian both. When he doesn't want to listen, he refuses to acknowledge someone at all, usually Gillian. It causes her to scream- but it's the exact opposite when HE wants to say something and SHE doesn't want to listen- he starts to melt down. This has improved quite a bit as well.
• Not going to bed good- we still have times when he does not go to sleep when it's bed time. Not as bad, but we're still working on it.
• Being violent- he hits Gillian out of anger a lot. It usually isn't hard, but he does do it purposely, and with her penchant for over reaction, it causes a global meltdown on both sides.
• Worrying about time- He used to constantly monitor whether or not the girls had finished their chores, and if they had, did they spend 2 minutes too long playing on the computer, or watching TV? It was a 4 times a day argument. Now, it happens every now and then, but not often.

Gillian

• Running through the house- it's improved
• Screaming- the same as with Chris- she has a lot of impulse control issues, so she tends to way over react and scream over little things, but it is getting better.
• Interrupting or not listening- ditto to Chris. Same exact thing- she'll either purposely ignore him until he melts down, or she'll melt down because he's ignoring what she's saying. Both kids have a big problem just jumping in and interrupting what other people are talking about. It's improved.
• Not finishing your chores- Gillian had a big problem with starting a chore, then drifting away- it was hard to keep track of whether or not she had actually finished the chores she was supposed to do, and more often than not, she didn't do them at all. She does still need some prodding along through the afternoon, but she is much more motivated to finish them.
• Being disrespectful- Gillian loves to be funny. She has a decent sense of humor. However, she doesn't always know when to stop, or where to draw the line on what is funny, and what is rude. She is improving on this as well.

Over all, the kids are doing much better, and I find that Nick and I have to scream a LOT less- the only time we raise our voices is if they are upstairs and we need to get their attention.

I've also found that while they have improved in a lot of areas, I think a lot of it comes more from seeing it on the list, as a lot of the above behavior are things we have not had to address hardly at all. In fact, some things I hadn't even realized they stopped doing- running, bossing people around, worrying about time management, etc.

It is still fairly early in the game. The kids have been doing their current chart for 11 days. However, I am pleased with the change in the kids. It's been a fairly positive change compared to what we normally see around here.

I also made up charts- I just made up a 4 column table in a word document. In the first column, it has DATE, with the dates listed under it. In the second column, it has POINTS, and they write down their points. The Third is another DATE and the fourth is another POINTS column. They each have a sheet dated from 3-6 up through 4-2. There is space under the table to write down any point purchases, so we can 'deduct' those points from their point 'accounts'. Similar to a bank, I suppose.

Well... that's really all I can think of on details for it, but if you have ANY questions, please feel free to ask!!

Day 2: Behavior Points & Chores

Today was a bit more rough than yesterday, though it was still fairly tame all things considered. Overall, though, I do like the point system.

Some quick background- I have insomnia. My particular type means that I can't fall asleep easily. Once I'm asleep, I'll remain asleep until my body is ready to wake up, but it usually means catching up on sleep during the day. It usually works out that once or twice a week, I'm napping when the kids get home- they're used to this, and old enough not to need direct supervision.

Today was just such a day. I was woken up by Chris fighting with Gillian. I asked them to stop as I tried waking up, but Chris was having a stubborn moment, and as such, was not really ready to listen to me.

After hearing him nag at Gillian for another few minutes more (due to whether or not she was actively doing her chores- this is something on our list of things we want to correct, as he spends a LOT of time, energy, and our patience in worrying about what the girls are doing), I finally told him he lost a point. He settled down shortly after that as I got out of bed.

I was surprised to see all 3 kids working at their chores, though, when I woke up. Chris was done, though to be honest, not really done. I've got him finishing up right now, as he had to do a load of laundry (all 3 kids know how to do laundry now, and it is on their chores, twice a week they each are responsible for doing their own laundry).

Raegan did her dishes fairly fast, and she also had to dry & put them away (every other day of the week, it falls so that 1 kid does the washing, and 1 kid does the drying and putting away, but there are only 2 kids doing dishes, and 3 doing the putting away, so it landed with Rae doing both today). On top of that, it was also her chore to clean off the counters- throw stuff away, put stuff away, and wash them off.

It's become habit in our house to ignore one entire corner of the kitchen counter. We have an L shaped counter, and the corner area is home to the coffee pot, can opener, coffee cans, container of utensils (spatulas, slotted spoons, etc), and the dish strainer. Unfortunatly, stuff gets shoved back there, and left. Every time.

It irks me, because it makes the entire kitchen look horrible, and yet, no one ever just picks stuff up. Even my husband ALWAYS leaves the griddle sitting there (we use it maybe once every 2 weeks). So while we were making dinner, I had Raegan come back out, and start that area.

It upset her, but it IS a chore that needs to be done, and if it's done several times a week, the "stuff" won't build up back there.

So, neither Chris nor Rae finished on time tonight, and with both of them, it was because they "forgot" to do part of their chores. Both "forgotten" parts are things they always "forget" so they don't have to do them. But, I am trying to get them all to be more responsible in their jobs around the house, including doing their chores completely.

Here's hoping!

So far, Chris is at 4 points, Gillian is at 6, and Rae is at 5, though she may lose one if she doesn't finish her chore tonight. I had told her when I first noticed it that I wouldn't hold it against her if she got it done. That was an hour ago- since then, she has taken over 45 minutes to eat a bowl of spaghetti, so she can avoid doing it. It's her evasive maneuver. Avoid notice by being out of site, or claim she is still eating so she can't be asked to do it. I told her at the start of this post that she had 5 minutes, which by now, were up 3 minutes ago.

Day 1: Behavior Points & Chores

Well, yesterday was Day 1 on the new Behavior Point Chart. To coincide with it, we also modified the chore chart to add in things that don't get done, and take off things that didn't need to be done as often as they were. Last summer, Chris went to Florida with my FIL for most of the summer, and that was the last time I re-did the chart. Chris didn't have assigned chores, we just found things for him to do. Now, they are all on the chart.

Overall, it went good. Raegan did try to sneak off and hide in her room, under the guise of changing out of jeans into sweats. After calling her down 2 separate times over a 25 minute period, she finally came back down.

Gillian did her chores, though she wound up doing some wrong ones, and having to do extra to do her assigned ones.

Chris did all of his without dragging his feet, or getting upset.

I did not have to take any points away at all yesterday- the kids did not fight even once, which is a miracle in and of itself.

In the end, Gillian earned 3 points, and Chris & Rae each earned 2, so they are at 8 & 7 for the day. Not bad for day 1!

Here's hoping the following days go as smoothly.

Behavior, Rewards, and Life with 3 Kids

As many of you know, I have 3 kids. Two of them are... trying, to say the least. Very least. Gillian is the baby at 9, and was diagnosed with Asperger's Syndrome this past fall. Stubborn, argumentative, and easily frustrated. Chris is 12, and while undiagnosed, has the exact same 'symptoms' as Gillian, only far more... pronounced. Highly argumentative, hyper, stubborn, and... well... he could try the patience of a saint. Raegan is our 'normal' kid, but normal only goes as far as normal is for an almost 15-year-old freshman.

Mix all 3 together, and Nick and I spend the better part of the evening asking why chores are not done, asking/yelling at kids to stop running/screaming/fighting/threatening/being rude/etc to one another. Seriously- we could probably set a clock to how often we are up and after the kids.

Last week, I was talking with a friend about their behavior. We've tried allowances, punishments, rewards, etc. Nothing works. Then it dawned on me that when Gilly was diagnosed, her school approached her behavior differently.  IE: Her class as a whole each have sticks. The sticks start off in the GREEN slot. If the student does something wrong, or bad (usually it's more than once), they are asked to move their sticks to YELLOW. If the behavior continues, it moves to RED. There is no redeeming once it's been moved- you are on yellow or red for the rest of the day.

In Aspie's, they've found that the system used is more of a melt down trigger, than a tool to aid in correcting the behavior.  As soon as Gilly was diagnosed, they moved her to a sliding scale point system.

Each day, she starts off with 10 points on a slide ruler. Through out the day, her actions can earn or take points away. For instance, if she's not paying attention, and is fiddling in her desk instead of working on math homework, she may be asked to take a point away. But, 10 minutes later, if she's helping her neighbor do the work, because she's already done, she might be told to add 1 or even 2 points. Her point scale is 0-25, meaning she can earn up to 25, or as few as 0 in a single day. Points earned for the day are her points to keep- they won't take today's points away tomorrow.

At the end of the day, she writes down her point total. Then, at the end of the week on Friday, she can go to the break room (which is a sensory room for kids who need sensory help- aspergers, autistic, etc), and can spend her points in a shop there. One time, she saved up her points for several weeks, until she had enough to purchase a private pizza party. For that, she spent "$20" in points, and got to invite a friend to eat lunch with her, where a pizza was brought in for her, soda.

When I realized how well that system has worked for her in school, I started considering how it might work here in the house. The point of the system is to not just point out the problem areas, but to reward the children in the areas they do well at. It helps them learn to correct the more impulsive behavior that leads to the most outbursts.

After talking with Nick, and drawing up a few 'plans', I finally settled on one that I hope will work here in the house.

The long and short of it, is that the kids start the day with 5 points, and can earn up to a total of 10 at the end of the day. They can't go into negative numbers, and once their numbers are banked at the end of the day, they can't lose their banked points.

I also came up with a rewards sheet that I think worked well with things the kids ask for the most often, with some small rewards that are easily obtainable in a single week, and some larger ones that will take longer than a week to save for.

Here's the rewards list:

25 Points- A small shake
40 Points- $5.00
75 Points- A movie ticket OR $10.00
100 Points- Dinner out with a parent of your choice, at the restaurant of your choice

I considered adding other small things in, but I felt that the dollar values will cover anything not listed. But the items listed- a shake, movie, or dinner out are things that the kids look at as treats that we rarely do. The shake is a small amount, and even if the week isn't a smooth one, it's something that they can earn in a single week.

If they have a perfect week, which I don't think will happen any time soon, they come out at 70 points, so just shy of $10 or a movie ticket.

I hope that in adding in things that take longer, the kids will start to 'bank' their points for bigger rewards, which helps teach them about saving instead of spending.

I also outlined samples of behavior that will either earn them points, or have points taken away.

For instance, doing their chores will not earn them points, because it's part of their job. However, I did add in a time frame in which to complete their chores after school. Currently, I have to remind the kids, call after them, and get right on them to get them even started, and for the most part, they don't finish them before 7pm, and only then because Nick is home and gets on their cases.

I also added in things like being respectful to one another, not bossing each other around, going to bed on time on school nights, helping out without being asked, picking up after your own messes, etc.

I did stress that if someone has to ask them to do something, then it isn't the same as just doing it. I also stressed that points are awarded or removed based on behavior noticed- ie: if Gilly says Chris did this, but we can't prove it happened, we likely won't be taking points away. Exaggerating is something both Chris and Gilly do a LOT of.

Over-reacting is another. Aspie kids tend to work on perception.  Chris might brush against her as he walks past, but in her mind, he pushed her, and did it on purpose. This is something that we can't stop from happening- we can't tell her how to perceive things. But, we can help her adjust how she reacts to those perceptions.

I really hope this works. We sat the kids down and explained the entire system to the kids, answered all their questions, and explained that we hope that by giving them reminders about bad behavior, and point rewards for good behavior, that it will help shape the way they act & react in the long run, making it a much smoother household, with less fighting, and out of control behavior.

Fingers crossed, hope it works!

I did also point out that while they are free to spend their points however they wish, we would be going on vacation in June, and it might be in their best interests to save some points up towards money for souviener shopping.

I can already tell, though, that Chris will cash out for cash, Gilly will cash out for a shake as soon as possible, and Rae will -try- to save up for dinner out, but will likely break down and want the cash.

More on Gillian

It's been a few weeks since we got the official diagnosis on Gillian, and already, she's made great improvements in class with visual cues, social stories, and break time.

Gillian was diagnosed with Asperger's Syndrome a few weeks ago, through a series of tests that her school did with her (with our blessing). Even though she was only recently diagnosed, the school was aware of it being a possibility since last year, and while they could never officially put the social stories, visual cues, and break times into effect, they were able to do a few things that didn't require the help of the OT.

Right now, Gillian has a card on her desk that just describes behavior that is good, not good, and really not good (I can't recall what they call it, but they are divided by a Green, Yellow, Red system for good, slow down, stop). It describes different things, like raising her hand is good, while blurting out is not good. Hitting or shoving are really the only two things I recall in the Red section.

If something happens in the Yellow section, she is reminded to look over her card. If it happens more than once, she gets points taken away. If she does something in the red, then the school recognizes that she needs a break to regroup, and she goes to the break room, which has a lot of sensory items in it, such as a trampoline, a soft squishy "people squisher" (kids kind of roll through it, and are light squished, which is great for sensory), plus other items. She's allowed to request a break if she's feeling flustered, but what I noticed on Wed, is that she was requesting it just to go. I think right now, she's just loving it, and wants to go as much as possible.

In class, she also has a ruler she keeps on her desk, or carries around. On the back, there are numbers 1-25 on it in marker, then they have a laminated 'slide' with a window that is wrapped around it with her name. Every day, the ruler starts out on number 10. If she does something in the yellow or red, she gets a point taken away. However, if she does something good, she gets to add a point.

The traditional method in class is useful with the regular students, but does not work good with kids who have outside problems like Autism or Aspergers. For the other kids, they have a popsicle stick. They start off in box 1, and it gets moved down if they misbehave (usually after a warning or two) from Green, to Yellow, to Red.

With that system, there are no rewards for positive behaviour. A lot of what Asperger's kids struggle with, is social interaction. They may not know how to react, so they just react however they want, where as other kids learn early one that it's maybe not all right to brag about winning, or to scream if someone looks at them wrong, or what not. With the slide ruler point system, Gillian gets rewarded with points for good behavior while also getting points taken away for bad behavior. She has room to make up for having an outburst, where as before, she would just go down hill, because while bad behavior was recognized, good was not.

She has been doing a lot better in class, and has a great group of support at the school to help her. She loves her break times, and she'll tell anyone who asks all about her "Ashburger Syndrum".

Gillian, my Baby

Gillian is my youngest child. She's my little baby, though don't tell her that! At almost 9, she would screech if she heard herself referred to as a baby.

Last Spring, Gillian's teacher approached me about some things she had seen in the classroom with Gilly that she felt looked a lot like Asperger's Syndrome. Her school used to be where the Autistic children in the district went- it was a mainstream school, but they have a Autistic Spectrum Teacher on staff, a special class room for helping them, and a lot of other resources.

We agreed to have Gillian tested when school started back up this fall, because we've always know something was different about Gillian. She's... special, for a lack of a different word. Gillian is just different, and quirky, and loving, and wonderful, but definitely different.

We just got the final word on the testing today- the school found that after extensive testing, which included Speech Therapy testing, physical therapy, observation periods, and much more, that Gillian does shows enough signs of Asperger's Syndrome to qualify for a diagnosis.

On Friday, we go in and sign her IEP, and go over what support will be put into place to help Gillian be as successful as she can be in school.

Gillian has know from the first moment why they were testing her, and what Asperger's is. I told her today what the school decided, and she asked if that was a bad thing. I told her it wasn't bad, that it just makes her special, and that it means that she'll have more help in school, and let other people help understand her better.

These two photos are two of my absolute favorite pictures of Gillian, because they show who she is. Gillian is just quirky, and isn't scared to be different, or march to the beat of her own drum.

 

 
It helps having a diagnosis. It doesn't change who Gillian is, but it can help other people understand her more.